Slavery? There are more slaves today than ever before in history

The concept of slavery needs to be extended as it directly linked to class subordination of human rights. Slavery, that is unpaid labor, can be achieved both directly and indirectly through the enslavement of workers through Capital subordination, cheap labor markets, and corporate fascist policies. The impoverishment of the whole world, where a handfull of billionaires make more than 80 percent of the world's population, gives lie to the false class ideology, that a class system is all about social wealth when it is in fact about slavery, dehumanization, in all its forms, sexual, race and gender exploitation and in general against working and middle class layers. Global corporate capitalist tyranny has created the conditions for these slave like conditions, that make direct slavery just an echo of its own inhumanity.

Can we please leave the Zombie people out of this?

Raat: Worse yet, the only real free Republic, Haiti, when the U.S. still had slavery, the U.S. refused to recognize Haiti, instead agreed with the property rights claim by France, that its former slaves owed the loss of income from slavery, as a government to pay their former slave masters, and colonial France, this debt, which took Haiti another 100years to pay off. So you can clearly see how the U.S. was not about "freedom", but about propertyr rights of white males, pretending democracy.

Eric, you never miss an opportunity to bash the US, do you?

In the meantime, I'd like a manifesto from you about the gross corruption and irresponsibility of the Haitian leaders and people which has brought unspeakable catastrophe upon themselves and the region...the billions of dollars in aid and good will squandered ... the darkness of the voodoo culture ... the environmental destruction and irresponsibility.

In your view, are there any other evil people in the world besides "white males" or is it just more easy and politically correct to focus all of your vitriol there?

This thread ought to be one where we can all agree that the issue of slavery is vile and must be stopped...not an excercise in politically partisan grandstanding.

Nor should the thread become a forum to bash a people and a culture you probably know very little about.

Have we not squandered billions ("goodwill"?) in Iraq?

Let's not assume the Haitians are at fault for their exploitation. They share an island with the Dominicans, who hold violent attitudes against them (though they are only slightly better off and similarly destitute) and have invaded the western part of Hispaniola repeatedly. They suffered under the Duvaliers, yet Baby Doc was allowed to leave for France with his and Michelle's stolen millions.

It's well and good to blame the people for deforestation and corruption, but consider the relentless poverty and degradation that has forced the people into some difficult choices.

Oh man. Why do you say "squandered" in Iraq? Are people there not deserving or capable of freedom? Is there something inherent in them that you believe makes this an impossibility? I hope I'm taking your remark in the wrong way. Please clarify.

Caro, don't assume what I know and what I don't, m'kay? And, I hope you can respond to Sir Monkey's excellent note above.

I didn't launch out into the tangential America-hatred that Eric did. That politicizing of this issue came in via Eric's anti-American rant, and I merely suggested that he focus on Haiti and not blame every stinking world problem on America. I notice your inability to leave "Iraq" out of this topic thread ... this Iraq fixation seems to afflict many here on Newsvine.

Where is the accountability and personal responsibility of the Hatian leadership and people?

If I'm reading his comment right, he means the billions wasted on and by defense contractors who stole a he*l of a lot of it, money that should have been spent helping the people of Iraq make real forward movement.

Least I hope that's what he meant.

Wow. Piling on is an interesting tact. Insolence must be cautiously applied, my friend. Make sure you're addressing the core of the matter, not a tangent:

Are people there not deserving or capable of freedom?

Wow. How did we move from an article about slavery in the modern era, with a focus on the trade in Haiti, to politics?

To sir monkey: I said squandered because we've poured billions into rebuilding a nation that is not yet stable enough for the efforts to take hold. Bridges are bombed, structures are bombed, we attempt to rebuild and it comes to naught. The war rages on and the chaos engulfs everything. It was not a dig against the Iraqi people nor their rights to freedom or their inherent character.

The war was elective and based on false information that we were too impatient to vet. I blame the U.S. leadership for that. Those billions of dollars could have been used to help our nation: crumbling infrastructure, flood damages, roads, bridges and schools, health care, infant mortatlity. The misdirection of these funds to an elective campaign that accomplished so little was a squandering of our resources. I stand by that claim.

To TomB.: "The darkness of the voodoo culture" are your words, and they dismiss a national religion that has filled the void left by the indifference of the Catholic Church and the world. The Haitians know they are alone in their suffering and can only rely on their exile community. They are bitterly aware that their government is corrupt. They have held uprisings and suffered the bullets of the police and the machetes of the gangs. Everyone does not have the freedom to protest that we enjoy, so I find your blaming of the Haitians for their own misery puzzling.

But I will leave Iraq out of further discussion on this thread. However, I don't accept that Eric Albert is "anti-America" because he is a harsh critic. This is his country too and I support the right of dissident voices to be heard. After all, that's what we insist in our diplomatic efforts abroad, and we need to do the same here.

Tom - I generally find you to be reasonable, but after reading this

In the meantime, I'd like a manifesto from you about the gross corruption and irresponsibility of the Haitian leaders and people which has brought unspeakable catastrophe upon themselves and the region...the billions of dollars in aid and good will squandered ... the darkness of the voodoo culture ... the environmental destruction and irresponsibility.

I do have to wonder about the applicability of this

Nor should the thread become a forum to bash a people and a culture you probably know very little about.

I mean, really, should we have a discussion about the history of Haiti, how those corrupt Haitian leaders came to power, and the way "the billions of dollars in aid and good will" was used to influence the country?

And is anyone here saying war is the most efficient use of money?

As far as the assertion of the seed, the evidence presented is far from proof, although measured strictly by numbers it is likely to be true. Comparisons of the qualitative differences still need to be made.

I think results are definitively important to consider. Intentions alone are not enough, though they are indeed important too. Accountability is important.

The UN pattern of behavior and results in Haiti is not unique. There are other examples too, where "well intentioned" policies result in "tolerance" of absolutely horrific results. Peace and tolerance are easily mis-applied.

I think the "peacekeeping" approach may eventually find its way into Iraq. Some espouse approaches that would create "peace" (quell more visible & immediate violent conflict) by handing over Iraq to AQI, Qods, Ba'athists, thugs, et al. A comparison of Haiti and Iraq is valid. Though Haiti is "peaceful", what are the real results of this peace?

Regarding Alwan, it would indeed have been nice for the BND to allow the US to have vetted him. There were indeed others that dropped the ball. The "relevance" of this is minimal in the discussion of how to proceed. It's important stuff, but other current conditions are more pertinent. Regarding Albert, he is anti-American because the principles he advocates are in direct violation to the principles of American liberty, not simply for being critical. And the voodoo issue was raised in the article. It does seem to be a factor because it limits the promotion of moral concepts that could help combat these immoral activities.

Just to put Eric's comment into context, it is worth remembering that class often underpins slavery. Also worth bearing in mind that although the article cites Haiti as an example where the practise abounds, there are other areas of the world where it still exists. Like the example that Sirensongs gives below in India. One sees examples throughout the whole of the sub-continent.

James, I was responding to Eric ... I have no interest in getting into some of those tangential issues, but no matter what the topic is, periodically Eric will chime in to bash America.

So, that was the context of my remark. Sorry if it came off as snarky. It probably was.

Tom-

Right on. Not judging, just wondering.

You could have turned him in. But you chose to do nothing I would say you are part of the problem... BMC Retired

I feel like you are shooting from the hip, something I'm trying not to do, BMC. I have no evidence, save his offhand comment that he has done anything. You were a chief, so what happens when I take this to my COC? They take down some notes on what I said, talk to him, then forget about it (it's already happened to me) Then I gotta work with the guy for 4 more years, while he, obviously an unscrupulous person, holds a grudge. If and when I have actually seen abuses, I have reported them (not that anything ever happens), and will in this case, but for right now, I feel like all I have is a story.

I agree Andy - there is very little evidence in an off-hand comment.

At the end of the day - you have to be aware that people who would frequent these places mentioned and take pleasure from slaves, are far from buddies, and should be watched carefully /avoided.

Good story BTW

the price is probably about economics

There are a lot more people now than in the early days of American slavery. So many desperate people, vulnerable people with no escape.

Thank you for your comment, sunnie. That just seems impossible, but not also. Very horrible and sad.

Please, please Google and find out for yourself.

So should we concern ourselves with the circumstances of others that we have surpassed, or should we concern ourselves with surpassing our current circumstances?

I think there is plenty of blame to go around, and what is often missed is that there aren't a whole of "US corporations" around. Any company bif enough to do the sort of work Dyncopr does is most likely a multinational. From the Board of Directors on down to employees may or may not be American. Often being "based" in America is a nice way to get contracts. Unfortunately this is privatization, which is a whole 'nother issue.

I don't think it is fair to either blame America, nor totally let it off the hook. We are more than an equal player in this world, and it should be nothing to stand up and acknowledge wrongs or pursue justice when appropriate. If we are not responsible, than we need to strongly come out against those who are. On the other hand, it would be better to scrutinize more closely those we allow to represent our interests in the world.

What good is it, when we contract for services or security of our interests, and they behave like this?

Yes, I don't think we should blur the distinction between slavery, such as in the article, and, for lack of a better term (please insert one here) "wage slavery". We, at least, can choose to direct our purchases away from slavery, for them and for ourselves. The very poor, even the destitute, have some control over where they spend the night; not so for slaves.

no no no, i am not talking about wage slavery. I am talking about slavery. These kids receive no wages, just rice and dal and a place to sleep on a bench in the corner. Most of them were 'sold' or bartered when their parents could not pay debts. This is very real slavery.

There's been a recent case of a 9 year old Sikh boy found in London. There is speculation that he may have been a victim of child traficking from India. See here.

Well, if he made it out of India, he's one of the lucky ones because he's now in a country where that is a crime. or at least, where the laws are more regularly enforced.

There are media reports that a family (couple + uncle) in Bihar are claiming that the boy is their lost son, a victim of child theft a few years back.

.......but I could feed them and give them a clean place to sleep, at least. I'm sure they'd have a happier life than the alternative the world is offering them.

What a terriffic thought...

You can bet you bottom dollar - some politically correct elf n safety social working official would find a thousand reasons why you couldn't do that and why they would have to live their abused lives ...